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Reply with quote  #1 
The most expensive Style U late 10's ever! The funny part is that he states all the time that everything is original... But the bridge is far from been original...

And just about 5 time too expensive, a bargain!


Cheers

Benoît
goaty76

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Reply with quote  #2 
Boy that looks clean but I agree that is a very high price for one of these.  What is it about the bridge that looks so off to you?

Phil

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Reply with quote  #3 
The bridge should be maple with ebony cap and the shape is wrong... I got a great insult email from the guy telling me I knew sh***t about Gibson harp guitars [cool] I sent him a quite sarcastic answer [smile]

Cheers

Benoit

PS: The HG in this condition is 17.000 too much [rolleyes]
goaty76

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Reply with quote  #4 
Not all had the ebony cap but it is missing the dip in the wood under the guitar strings. 

http://orgs.usd.edu/nmm/PluckedStrings/Guitars/Gibson/1147/HarpGuitar.html

http://www.themusicemporium.com/product-detail/product/gibson-style-u-harp-guitar-1916.html

http://www.emeraldcityguitars.com/product/1915-gibson-model-u-harp-guitar/

Was it only later one's from the teens that had the all maple bridge?  He doesn't list the serial number so there is no way to confirm what year it's really from.



Phil

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Reply with quote  #5 
The serial number put it right on the 1908 period (8618), so one of the first floating bridge ones? Another problem with the bridge: if you looks the shape of the hole under the guitar strings it's absolutely NOT the shape it should be. If you go to "more photos", you can see the serial number AND a font number (who makes no sens). Yes the HG from the museum have a full maple bridge, some of them do (mainly in the 10's) if you look at this photo the feet of the bridge is longer comparing to this one, they are machine made and quite crude. And finally if you looks closely at the photos from both bridges, the 3 you have posted have exactly the same shape, the one on his have longer feet on bass and guitar side.The only interesting thing with this HG is that we can say it's a very early floating bridge one: the rosette is stile the old one, use on glue bridges...

One another subject: did you noticed that this one have the "missing binding" between neck and scroll? Just some of the late 10's have it... laziness???

Cheers
Benoît
goaty76

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Reply with quote  #6 
I missed the "more pics" button on my fist look at the instrument.  Those are some very nicely detailed photos.  Anyway I'm now under the impression that there is a very good chance this is the original bridge.  1907-1910 was a time of growth at Gibson.  New models as well as new hardware were being developed.  I started a topic about this subject here http://theunofficialmartinguitarforum.yuku.com/topic/154343/190810-Gibson-Style-Os

The new design of the Gibson Style O came out in 1908 with the scroll body and floating tailpiece and bridge.  However that hardware was not patented till 1910 as can be seen stamped on the tailpieces of the guitars from the teens and 20's.  There were no scroll body Style O's with set bridges (that we have seen).  So Gibson used it for 2 years before actually being issued the patent.

This Harp Guitar appears to have been built right at the time these new changes were taking place. If it had been built any later I would say no way about that bridge but.... That bridge could just be a slightly different/cruder early evolution of the bridge we are accustomed to seeing.  Also I notice that there are no holes or marks in the bridge, binding, or body that would indicate that this instrument ever had a floating pickguard.  Ever seen that on a Style U with "newer" floating tailpiece system before?  More evidence of transition in this instrument? 

Then there's the fact that this example is in such nice condition.  If this was a beat up instrument I would be more inclined to say that some one put on a repro bridge.  But it looks to match the rest of the instrument.

Do I think any of this warrants the price they are asking? No, still I find it interesting. 

Or I could be wrong about everything.  Wouldn't be the first or last time.

Phil

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Reply with quote  #7 
I see your point, BUT there are 2 details you are missing:
Gibson, back then was quite consistent in design look: What ever material they used for the bridge (ebony rosewood, maple or maple with a cap of ebony) they always tuse a symetrical shape hole with the spike on the middle. And second, to me  the scroll body you have posted have not his original bridge (should be  pin floating bridge, this bridge stamped 1910 can't be find in a 1908!). Another point, the asymmetrical shape of the hole is quite modern for a 1908 Gibson and again feet are quite long, Gibson used quite short feet in all there designs...

Cheers

Benoît

PS: Wen I contacted the saler about the bridge he insulted me so much that I have even less consideration for him... I think he just over did it on the cleaning (and probably refinish) and probably new bridge as well...
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Reply with quote  #8 
I don't want it to seem like I am arguing with you over this, as I could easily see either of us being  correct about it.  However I am enjoying the research and investigation this has brought about.  Take a look at this :
xx.jpg
It is the original patent for the Style O and it's parts. That bridge looks incredibly similar in design to the Harp Guitar's.  Gibson was pretty exact in these patent drawings.  Like I said we need a look at an instrument with-in a few serial numbers to compare.

Phil


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goaty76

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Reply with quote  #9 
Here is the patent for the harp guitar.  Notice in the upper right-hand corner the same bridge being shown without the standard dip that we are used to seeing.

Phil
gibson_patent.jpg 


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Reply with quote  #10 
I see your point. BUT look at both drawing of the bridge even if the point is missing they have a symmetrical design... And I'm looking for HGs with close serial numbers as whe speaks...


Regards

Benoit
goaty76

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Reply with quote  #11 
So this 1908 L-3 http://www.ebay.com/itm/121572309706?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&fromMakeTrack=true popped up and to me this is confirmation that the bridge on the harp guitar is original and an example of the earliest form of the Gibson floating bridge. 

Since this thread has not had any pictures posted of what we are talking about I thought I should post some for posterity sake.


1908 Gibson Harp Guitar Bridge from the OP
Harp Bridge.jpg 


1908 Gibson L-3 Bridge
L-3 Bridge.jpg 


Looking forward to any thoughts.

Phil



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